Other people’s sexual choices – do they matter?

Andrew F comments on another thread that there are more important things to debate than “other people’s sexual choices and society’s efforts to tolerate those choices” and suggests I am becoming “a very sick person”.

Firstly, there are many important things to debate. Andrew is still to this day, I believe, a New Labour supporter. They spent a vast amount of parliamentary time and effort trying to ban hunting foxes with dogs at the expense of far more important things.

Secondly, should we be concerned about what other people do in their bedrooms? Forty years ago, homosexual behaviour was legalised between two adults over twenty-one. In their own bedroom. Here we are now with the behaviour having left the bedroom and now being promoted to schoolchildren as normal.

The age of consent has been reduced to sixteen for ‘equality’ purposes, in effect legalising pederasty.

Some adoption agencies have closed because they refused to consider homosexual couples as suitable foster parents.

So, yes, what goes on ‘in the bedroom’ has a wider impact.

One major problem caused by recognising homosexual behaviour as normal is the knock-on effect of devaluing family life. Families are the basic building block of society. Weaken these and you build a weak society. Treat all ‘relationships’ the same as marriage and society will begin to collapse.

Following the attack by two Doncaster children on two of their peers, Iain Duncan Smith has warned against dismissing the episode with the usual calls for an inquiry and a tighter system, which he said would fail to tackle the root problem.

The Christian Institute reports on The Independent’s Bruce Anderson comparing the circumstances of the Doncaster boys with those of 17-month-old Baby Peter, who died at the hands of his mother and her live-in boyfriend.

We have allowed an underclass to come into being” based on “seven deadly sins”.

First, the collapse of the family. Second, the collapse of fatherhood; Dad’s sole role is impregnation. Third, the collapse of all inhibitions about producing children. Fourth, the collapse of the work ethic. Fifth, crime. Sixth, drugs. Seventh, and underpinning the lot, promiscuous welfare.

The PC nonsense again manifests itself in other ways

Last month a social policy expert warned that the child protection system is ignoring background risk factors such as broken families because it fears stigmatising children.

Jill Kirby, Director of the Centre for Policy Studies, also referred to the case of Baby Peter.

His circumstances were “typical of the average ‘at risk’ child”, she said, listing other common “background factors” including “having a mother who was a teenage lone parent, the presence of an unrelated male in the household, a history of domestic violence, a parent with a criminal record or a history of mental illness and substance abuse”.

So what is the answer? It’s easy: promote marriage between a man and a woman and consider all other ‘lifestyles’ to be of lesser value. Ditch the blasted PC agenda once and for all and start teaching children the truth. See through the fake charities like Stonewall and stop them using their ‘bullying’ campaign to get access to schools to recruit by process of normalising homosexual behaviour.

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22 Responses to Other people’s sexual choices – do they matter?

  1. Andrew F says:

    Well, you could have edited out the typo. “The society”. :)

    And no, I am not and have never been a “New Labour supporter”. I’m a socialist who supports the Labour party because I’m terrified of the Conservative party.

    Another way of putting it is that I hate Tom Harris for the exact opposite reasons to you. :D

  2. Stewart Cowan says:

    Sorted your typo. Right enough, you’re not New Labour, but you do like all that false equality nonsense, don’t you?

    You don’t *have* to vote New Labour. I don’t want the Tories either, so I’ll be voting, well, UKIP probably. The main parties are full of traitors. Why would you want to vote for any of them? The left/right thing is a game to make us think we have a choice.

    I don’t hate Tom Harris. I think he’s probably a decent enough bloke who has fallen in with a bad crowd!

  3. John says:

    Well Stewart there is always the Scottish Christian Party to vote for …

  4. English Viking says:

    I would have thought a reasonable definition of a ‘New Labour supporter’ would be a person which has in the past, or intends in the future, to vote for them. See how 13 years of dreadful propaganda has allowed people to learn the skill of Double-Think. They deny being a New Labour supporter in one breath, then admit that are a supporter in the next, whilst all the time retaining the delusion that they are being consistent and that anyone who disagrees with them is obviously a supporter of ‘The Nasty Party’. The reason most socialists fear the Tories is that if they gain power, all the socialists will have to get a job.

  5. Stewart Cowan says:

    John – I have considered the Christian parties and voted for one before now. One of my main priorities is that we get out the EU, hence UKIP. At the moment.

    English Viking – Doublethink is rife these days and Andrew certainly has a strange reason for voting New Labour. He’s bought into the ‘false left/right paradigm’ like so many others. Like I had not so long ago. He comes across as quite smart sometimes, so I have hope for him.

  6. Andrew F says:

    Ha. Well, since I’m 18, I’ve only ever voted in local and European elections. But voting Labour is purely a matter of logic. I live in a Tory-Labour marginal, and I detest the Conservative party and everything they stand for.

  7. Stewart Cowan says:

    But, Andrew, Nu Labour and Blu Labour are owned by the same corporate globalists. There are other options. I detest the “Conservative” party because they’re not conservative any more, just like “Labour” isn’t for the working man anymore.

    Things must change and voting red/blue won’t change anything.

  8. Andrew F says:

    Well, firstly, I don’t accept that what you say is true. Labour governments since 1997 – especially the early ones – introduced a few wonderfully progressive things that a Tory government never would have. I’m thinking particularly of the minimum wage, of massive investment in the NHS (whatever you could possibly say about waste in, and mismanagement of, the NHS, you can’t deny that increased spending in that area has yielded results that are frankly world-changing for thousands of paitents), of huuuuge reductions in poverty (especially, but not exclusively, child poverty), and yes, of civil partnerships.

    I want to see more reforms along those lines. I’m not expectant, but I’m far more likely to get them from a party that has to at least pay lip-service to socialists than from a party that has to its lip-service to people with similar views to your own.

    Secondly: who else do you expect me to vote for exactly? At the risk of opening myself to stalking, I’ll tell you that my home constituency is the most marginal in the country. In 2005, Labour held it by just 37 votes. Admittedly, this means that it’s a pretty much certain gain for the Tories in 2010, but still: why would I waste my support on, say, a Green party candidate that has absolutely no hope?

  9. Andrew F says:

    *…than from a party that has to pay its lip service to people like you

  10. Stewart Cowan says:

    People like *me*, Andrew, people like me? I shall return!

  11. English Viking says:

    How did I guess that Andrew had experienced nothing but ‘edyucashun’ for the last 13 years? The last time he experienced anything other than the rubbish that we have got at the moment, he was 5, yet he seems to think himself politically astute. Labour have ‘invested’ billions into the NHS, only to see it have amongst the worst cancer survival rates in the Western world, gross under-employment of staff, gross over-payment of some staff, politicised work force, PC management, C diff, MRSA (which, by the way, is currently directly responsible for deaths of about 16,000 people since the last election, and people worry about swine-flu!), etc, etc. Huge reductions in poverty? I think you, Andrew F, are either a labour troll or you are simply repeating the rot you’ve been indoctrinated with at skool, init? Poverty is when you have no food, clothes or shelter. It is not the inability to afford a Playstation or 200 fags. Homelessness has increased dramatically since Labour got into power, thanks mainly to the shameful treatment of returning UK troops who are mentally disturbed by being forced to participate in illegal wars. We are almost entirely dependent on imports for clothing, mostly from China, India and other under-developed countries, where the workforce understand real poverty. This due to socialists with their ‘global solutions for global problems’. The quality of food in this country is mostly, quite frankly, garbage. Laden with chemicals, growth enhancers, pesticides, mono-sodium-glutamate and goodness know what else. Minimum Wage? £5.80 from next month. All that framing a figure as a minimum has done is allow employers to claim that they are abiding by the rules when they exploit their workers. Unemployment, when calculated the same way it was in Thatcher’s day, is currently approaching 4 million. The economy is in the bin, debt to GDP ratio is worse than Iceland’s (you may recall they have had a few problems recently). This Government has printed hundreds of billions of pounds it cannot possibly hope to pay back without massive inflation. The final point you raise as one of Labour’s crowning achievements are civil partnerships. If you are referring to the obscenity of allowing people with deviant sexual behaviour to flaunt their sin before the nation, degrade the real institution of marriage, corrupt the minds of weak and fickle youth into thinking that is a good thing (as yours apparently has been) and pollute society with their perverse equality agenda, you are a living example of why teenagers should not be allowed to vote. ‘A man, at age 20, if not a socialist, has no heart. A man, at age 40, if still a socialst, has no brain’.

  12. Roger Penney says:

    I want to offer on two points.
    First I remeber the landslide victory of the old Labour party led by Atlee. Most of you will not. We(my family) thought the millenium had arrived and, for a few seconds, it had. The NHS was undermined by the doctors but it still was a wonderful idea until it inevitably with all human institutions became institutionalised. Now it is run for the benifit of managers, doctors and nurses. We can also see how this has happened with schools and a lot of other institutions. This is inevitable given the state of human nature.
    I might add that you only get real reform when there is the Judeo-Christian ethic to base it on as, for instance, the anti-slavery movement.
    My second response is about Christians and voting. Would we not all agree that Christians are citizens of heaven and thus belong to another country and should not interfere in the politics (citizenship-politeuma) of the country of residence? Moreover Christians are also ambassadors for their own country and may soon be withdrawn as war is soon to be declared between the ruler of heaven and the ruler of earth.
    Roger P.

  13. Andrew F says:

    *sigh* You once reveal a personal detail to a right wing nut, and they at once seize on it to me uninformed, ad hominem attacks. The vast majority of young people are not politically “indoctrinated”; they’re completely disengaged from anything related to politics. Of the few that remain, political loyalties were always evenly split at the school I went to.

    You paint ludicrous picture of the NHS. Since 1997, waiting times have shot down: under the Tories, people would regularly wait up to 18 months for an operation. Now, no one waits more than 6 months. Cancer survival rates? International comparisons are irrelevant: what matters in deciding who to vote for is that cancer survival rates have risen under Labour. And what’s more? In 1996, only 63% of people suspected of having cancer by their GP saw a specialist within two weeks. Now it’s 99%. Many thousands more doctors and nurses treat people on a daily basis. 95% A&E inpaitents seen within four hours of arrival. And 9 out of 10 paitents using the NHS rate their care as “excellent” Facts. Get some or shut up.

    Child poverty has fallen massively since Labour came to power. Find me a respected measure by which it has risen. But hey, if you want to talk about proper poverty, the kind where people have “no food, no clothes, no shelter”, then answer me this: what do you think has happened to the level of Britain’s overseas aid since Labour came to power? Yeap, exactly.

    Illegal wars? What would those be exactly? Would that be the multi-national response to 9/11 in Afghanistan or our humanitarian intervention in Kosovo? Oh, you mean Iraq. Which was one war. Which the Conservative party supported. Which, at a cost of 179 British lives, removed from power a regime which had killed hundreds of thousands of civilians. There are positives to be found in the Iraq debacle.

    The economy isn’t in the bin. It’s in recession. Recessions happen. What doesn’t very often happen is eleven years of economic growth alongside low inflation. People talk like that’s not worth anything – as if this contraction is going to wipe that out, which it really won’t.

    Our debt ratio is tiny when you compare it to countries like Italy and Japan (and even the U.S.), and they’ve been dealing with it just fine for the last fifty years. This hysteria about public debt amongst the uneducated classes really is a Tory propaganda victory – nothing else. How anyone can get upset about us owing 45% of GDP when one of the Japan, one of the strongest economies in the world, owes over 100% is beyond me.

    We import most things? Well, yes, but that’s got nothing to do with Labour policies, has it? That would be Thatcher, pal.

    And then you launch into a bigoted rant. I’m really not going to bother addressing an argument premised on the fact that something is a “sin” according to your favourite work of fiction. I’ll just respond that, according to JK Rowling, Dumbledore’s gay, and he leads the fight against evil in Harry Potter. So there. I win.

  14. Andrew F says:

    I might add that you only get real reform when there is the Judeo-Christian ethic to base it on as, for instance, the anti-slavery movement.

    Hahaha, you’re going to give Christian ethics credit for ending slavery? How about credit for sustaining it in the centuries previously?

  15. English Viking says:

    ‘You once reveal a personal detail to a RIGHT WING NUT……..blah blah…….. ad hominem attacks’. Do you see the hypocrisy Andrew? ‘NHS waiting times have shot down’.. Partly because the clock doesn’t start ticking from the time you see a GP, which in itself can take a couple of weeks, it starts ticking from the time you see a Consultant, which can take months. Average waiting time for all operations, not just the easy ones the Gov like to count, like in-growing toenails? 11 MONTHS. Garbage. I was suspected of having a tumour during a visit to the equivalent of a GP when in Scandinavia a couple of years ago. I called the GP in the morning, saw him in the afternoon, saw a consultant at 10 am the next day, exploratory surgery under full anaesthetic at 2pm the same afternoon, biopsy results (all clear, praise God) 6 days later. Cost me 60 quid. That’s excellence. My son also required urgent surgery on club-feet, same levels of excellence. You say International comparisons are irrelevant, is that because it shows how badly the UK is doing against it’s tiny neighbours? It’s not irrelevant to those who either die or deteriorate so much that they become untreatable before they get to see a consultant. The NHS should have improved under Labour, they’ve spent a TRILLION quid on it. It employs the second largest workforce in the world, second only to the Chinese army. The Norwegian response time to an A and E admission is less than half an hour. There is no such thing as child poverty in Britain, It is not possible in a Welfare State (yet). The way the figures are calculated is by comparing the relative incomes of both high and low income brackets, and saying the bottom 20% are in poverty. This does not take into account all sorts of factors, including massive immigration, nor fluctuation in the top earning percentiles. The UK Gov admitted that it has abandoned its fantasy policy of ‘eradicating child poverty by 2012′ just recently. Did you miss that one? It can never be eradicated when defined as I have just explained, because there will always be a bottom 20% of earners, even if their earnings are a million quid a week. These are all nonsenses, known nowadays as ‘spin’, which not long ago used to be known as lies. They are about a useful as announcements of the increase of tractor production in the Urals, glorious comrade. Britain’s overseas aid is simply disgusting. Funny how the people who don’t contribute to it think its great. Why are we giving hundreds of millions of pounds to a state which can afford nuclear weapons, one of the largest standing armies in the world and has it’s own space programme – India, when they cannot (will not) feed and clothe and house their own people? Why are we propping up an apartheid state, which if the colours involved were reversed would be subject to goodness knows how many sanctions and fake charity pop concerts – Zimbabwe? And you think that this is a good thing? You claim that only Iraq is illegal. Wrong. We bombed sovereign nations and slaughtered hundreds in Kosovo and Serbia (they used to be the same thing until lefties got involved) without a declaration of war, the same thing Hitler (National SOCIALIST party) did when he entered Poland. We invaded Iraq without UN second resolution. When St Tony was told by the Attorney General that this was Illegal. he was told to go away and come back with ‘better’ advise. Dr David Kelly was not so compliant, so I he just had to go. When the USA is attacked by 19 SAUDI ARABIANS, GREAT BRITAIN attacks AFGHANISTAN. I just can’t get my head around that one. By the way, Saddam was responsible for far fewer deaths than either the ‘liberation’ or the following insurgency which is still ongoing. The economy is most definitely in the bin, you probably just haven’t realised as your Government money still keeps popping up in your account. The OECD Economic Outlook 2009 forecast UK Borrowing to GDP as a catastrophic 14%. Not National Debt, which you appear to confuse with this statistic, the ratio between how much UK PLC earns and how much it borrows. That is far worse than America and Japan, in fact it is THE worst of all the 28 countries whose economies are significant enough for the OECD to investigate. Grossly overinflated house prices and staggering levels of personal debt are not ‘economic growth’, they are a house of cards. Please don’t make the mistake of tarring me a tory. I dislike all politicians, they are responsible for the dire situation we find ourselves in and, even worse, for numbing the minds of the people who think everything is just fine and help the insane merry-go-round of left-right politics to continue. I particularly disliked Thatcher, who you childishly blame for the problems experienced today, in fact anything you don’t like, even though she left power almost 20 years ago. before you were born. I particularly dislike Cameron as well, and you are correct in thinking that Conservative victory is something to be frightened of, but don’t vote Labour because they are not conservative, or because your dad did, or you’re Northern, or you think Che Guevara made good T-shirts. To compare a penny dreadful about a gay wizard with the glorious Holy Bible is beneath contempt and not worthy of comment. I was going to say that you have the debating skills of a six-form agitant, but ‘so there I win ‘ is more like first-form. BTW, I’m not your ‘pal’.

  16. JuliaM says:

    “I’ll just respond that, according to JK Rowling, Dumbledore’s gay, and he leads the fight against evil in Harry Potter. So there. I win.”

    Oh, wow! Snappy comeback! Andrew F wins the thread…

    Not!

    “I was going to say that you have the debating skills of a six-form agitant, but ’so there I win ‘ is more like first-form.”

    I think, in Andrew, we have the quintessential Labour voter, the product of the educational system they have been striving to create. Tribal, an indescriminate consumer, vaguely aware that there’s something wrong though unable to put his finger on what, trumpeting statistics and talking points from other blogs with no real understanding of them, and possessed of a vast amount of totally unearned self-confidence.

    Take a bow, Andrew! You surely are the future. Heaven help us all…

  17. Andrew F says:

    Paragraphs, they’d be great.

    “You say International comparisons are irrelevant, is that because it shows how badly the UK is doing against it’s tiny neighbours? It’s not irrelevant to those who either die or deteriorate so much that they become untreatable before they get to see a consultant.”

    They are irrelevant to what we are (or at least, were) were debating – something you appear to have lost sight of amidst all the vitriol. Labour’s performance relative to its electoral opponents decides the destination of my “support”. And in all the areas that are important to me, they’ve done better historically than the Conservative party.

    The fact that Scandinavian countries do better still is not pertinent. However, illustrate what could happen if people like you got out the way and allowed us to set tax rates at a sensible level like they do. If you want world class healthcare, it needs to be paid for.

    With regards to child poverty, the anti poverty agenda was always tied into the reduction of social exclusion. In other words, it’s about dissolving the underclass – the countless people who because of their economic circumstances can’t participate fully in society. I don’t pretend to be entirely happy with the way Labour has dealt with this issue: it’s well known that income inequality has grown since Blair came to power. But they have made some strides on increasing social mobility for the very poorest – and they got many of those who Thatcher and co. conspired to make unemployed back into work.

    “Britain’s overseas aid is simply disgusting. [and here are a few isolated examples lifted straight from the Daily Mail]”

    I could go example to example with you of all the great things done with public money overseas. Of course in a few instances it’s going to be used for nefarious diplomatic purposes. But ultimately it comes down to whether you believe Britain should be selfish and nationalistic or compassionate and concerned? I want Britain to use its wealth for good purposes.

    “We bombed sovereign nations and slaughtered hundreds in Kosovo and Serbia (they used to be the same thing until lefties got involved) without a declaration of war, the same thing Hitler (National SOCIALIST party) did when he entered Poland.”

    We stopped mass killings in Kosovo, just as we did in Sierra Leone. I went to the latter last October; I didn’t find a single person who could complain about British troops turning up to stop the slaughter. If you don’t believe humanitarian intervention, in defending the weak against the horrors of ethnic cleaning, then I really don’t see how you can claim to adhere to the doctrines of Jesus Christ. If there’s one piece of dogma that stands out in the N.T., it’s that we have duty to each other.
    “When the USA is attacked by 19 SAUDI ARABIANS, GREAT BRITAIN attacks AFGHANISTAN. I just can’t get my head around that one.”

    You’re not very bright then, are you? The organisation they represented and which trained them, Al Qaeda, was primarily based in Afghanistan, and it was harboured and supported by the de facto Afghani government – the Taliban.

    “Saddam was responsible for far fewer deaths than either the ‘liberation’ or the following insurgency which is still ongoing.”

    Not by any estimate I’ve seen? Probably over a million died in the Iraq-Iran war alone. We’ll probably never know how many deaths Hussein personally authorised during his time in power. And very, very few of the violent deaths in Iraq since 2003 are attributable to British forces. We’re not even talking about the same kind of magnitude as the number Saddam killed.

    “Not National Debt, which you appear to confuse with this statistic, the ratio between how much UK PLC earns and how much it borrows.”

    I didn’t confuse it – I just assumed you were referring to national debt, since private debt really isn’t as big a concern quite frankly. The government can’t be held completely responsible for levels of personal debt anyway. If it was regulated, people like you would cry, “socialism!”

    “Grossly overinflated house prices and staggering levels of personal debt are not ‘economic growth’, they are a house of cards.”

    But sustained increases in GDP are. And that’s what we’ve had.

    “Thatcher who you childishly blame for the problems experienced today”

    Nope, just for the lack of any productive industry and a social underclass. :)

    “don’t vote Labour because they are not conservative”

    But that’s an excellent reason to not vote for them!

    “because your dad did”

    I think my dad votes Lib Dem. But yeah, political influence is not something he has a lot of where I’m concerned.

    “or you’re Northern”

    West Sussex.

    “or you think Che Guevara made good T-shirts.”

    I’m sorry to ask, but are these just the reasons you voted Labour when you were 18? Are you just assuming everyone’s as dumb as you?

    “To compare a penny dreadful about a gay wizard with the glorious Holy Bible is beneath contempt and not worthy of comment.”

    Ha. Typical religious response to an analogy – no counter-argument, just indignance.

    “I was going to say that you have the debating skills of a six-form agitant, but ’so there I win ‘ is more like first-form.”

    Yeah, I was mocking you, pal. Your argument about civil partnerships is the intellectual equivalent of basing public policy on Harry Potter.

    “BTW, I’m not your ‘pal’.”

    Woops. Sorry, mate. I’m not a first former or a sixth former, I’m not childish, I’m not a Labour troll, I haven’t been indoctrinated (I love how people like you make generalisations about an education system they’ve never experienced and which is turning out generations of people who, with a few exceptions, hate the Labour party), and I don’t believe I’m a “living example of why teenagers should not be allowed to vote”. So, how about we call it even?

  18. Andrew F says:

    *”to not vote for them” should be “to vote form them”

  19. Stewart Cowan says:

    Roger – We have seen in recent years just how much we relied on the Judeo-Christian ethic to deliver a fair society. It was eroded, for example, because the feminists wanted the sisters to be empowered by being sat at a desk or supermarket checkout all day earning just enough to be able to afford a car and petrol to get them to and from work.

    It annoys me when I hear it said that Christian women are treated as second-class citizens. I have found that the more religious the household, the more it is the woman who is in charge!

    She doesn’t need to wear a tabard with “Tesco” emblazoned on it to feel like she’s in control!

    As for Christians getting involved with politics, I have debated this with J’s Witnesses, who believe this, and completely disagreed with them. Not only does it feel right and good to stand up against injustice, but scripture is full of the Almighty’s people also doing just this.

  20. Andrew F says:

    “I think, in Andrew, we have the quintessential Labour voter, the product of the educational system they have been striving to create. Tribal, an indescriminate consumer, vaguely aware that there’s something wrong though unable to put his finger on what, trumpeting statistics and talking points from other blogs with no real understanding of them, and possessed of a vast amount of totally unearned self-confidence.

    Take a bow, Andrew! You surely are the future. Heaven help us all…”

    I think, in Julia, we have the quintessential vacuous blog commenter with nothing to contribute to the debate. You know nothing about me, dear.

  21. Stewart Cowan says:

    I’ve read your comments and thank you for participating, now let’s all calm down and try and work through this together…

    The NHS – good idea. They’ve helped me a couple of times in the past: quickly and efficiently. I believe it could be run better on less money. For example, £100,000 or more for a GP’s salary is an insult to the taxpayers. The NHS shouldn’t be responsible for paying for sex-changes, unnecessary beauty surgery and especially abortions.

    Slavery has been around for millennia and still is today. Wm Wilberforce, a Christian, finally managed to get black slavery ended after many years of trying. Slavery isn’t a ‘Christian’ thing; that’s ridiculous. Where do you get ‘em from, Andrew? Now, just say you got it wrong and we can move on and it never needs to be mentioned again.

    The immoral wars: It is now Sept. 11th, the eighth aniv. of the US Administration attacking their own cities in order to a) ensure future oil supplies in Iraq and the pipeline through Afghanistan and b) so that Western governments can use the ensuing ‘War on Terror’ to enslave the people through freedom-restricting measures to ‘keep as safe’.

    I will post on 9/11 later.

    New Labour can be blamed for creating a real, massive, underclass. Thatcher certainly takes a lot of blame for killing off the future of people in dozens of mining communities. I detested Mrs T. I was so hopeful in 1997. It seems like yesterday that Tony was walking up Downing Street with crowds waving Union flags.

    What a trail of destruction he has left. From here to Afghanistan.

    Overseas aid – sure, help people out if we can – and win orders for (what’s left of) British industry while we’re at it. As far as India is concerned, it’s difficult, as so many people are considered beneath the contempt of the others.

    Fake charities (ASH, Stonewall, Brook, FPA, NSPCC, etc.) should have their money stopped.

    Most of all, we need the Almighty’s guidance and to burn the PC agenda in the lake of fire, home of its author, the Devil.

  22. English Viking says:

    Andrew,

    You still seem to think that I am trying to convince you to vote Tory, I’m not. For goodness sake, don’t vote for any of the idiots that have brought such destruction to a once great nation.

    Raising new points before answering those raised by your opponent, or simply ignoring facts that are inconvenient to your argument, is childish.

    Under Labour, unemployment is higher than when they attained power and benefit claims are the highest they’ve ever been. Under Labour, the UK has illegally invaded or bombed 3 countries. The invasion of Iraq was based on a lie of imminent threat to the UK of WMD. An outrageous lie. The Con party helped in this madness, an excellent reason note to vote for them. Same as Labour. The invasion of Afghanistan was based on the lie that the 911 terrorists were trained there by Al Qaeda. Not a shred of evidence to prove this, almost all were citizens of Saudi Arabia and trained there, in Syria and in the US.

    You went to Sierra Leone and couldn’t find a single person who disagreed with military intervention there. Perhaps that’s because it was on such a small scale, and it largely achieved it’s aims in a very short period of time without the need for mass bombing, chemical weapons, execution of it’s government, the infliction of a puppet Prime Minister on a sovereign nation, etc. If you go to Iraq, or Afghanistan, or Serbia, you will find MILLIONS of people who object most violently. That is of course if they are still alive. If we invaded Iraq to free it from Saddam (we didn’t, it was all about WMD, which in itself was a lie, it was about oil) because he was oppressing his people, introducing the Iran-Iraq war casualties is unfair as this was not the reason given for invasion. The US was providing him with the money and weaponry he need to prosecute that war, so they can’t have it both ways, and neither can you.

    You assume that I am a follower of Christ, and even state that I claimed to adhere to the teachings of the Lord Jesus Christ. I never made any such claim, although I do know that the OT and NT do not teach that those in the world who are oppressed are to be delivered by unbelievers, using bullets, bombs and indiscriminate air-raids. Please don’t try to justify outrageous slaughter on a gargantuan scale as the Christian thing to do. The Labour party ‘doesn’t do God’.

    We have not had real growth in GDP, how can we, we don’t make anything. We have had imaginary growth fuelled by a deliberately created housing bubble and enourmous amounts of personal credit. You still haven’t grasped the GDP to Borrowings ratio I explained earlier, do pay attention at the back please! Not personal borrowings (the highest in history), not National Debt (the highest in history), The amount the Government will borrow in a year when expressed as a percentage of its GDP. It is the highest of all 28 developed nations. Catastrophic inflation is inevitable. Buy shares in a wheelbarrow company. The Gov has even resorted to Zimbabwe-like tactics and is running the printing press at warp speed. This is not economic success. You may think it is, you’re wrong.

    Thatcher cannot continue to be blamed for things that successive Labour governments have had 13 years and trillions of pounds to rectify.

    I don’t read the Daily Mail, but just because a fact appears in its editorials will not undo the validity of that fact.

    You think that voting Labour simply because they are not Tory is a good enough reason. By that logic, you could vote BNP. OOHHH! How dare I use language like that!

    You finish your reply with a series of ‘you are so, I am not’ type of statements which proves nothing but your inability to maintain the dialectic.

    BTW, where I come from (I’m Northern, so don’t think I dislike Northerners), calling someone ‘pal’ and ‘mate’, who is not your pal or mate, is usually a pre-cursor to a fight. I’ll let you off this time.

    Howd’ya like my paragraphs?

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